Discussion – S6E11 – "Gone"

[Warduke]

After you've seen the episode, this is the place to discuss it.

And remember, do not post any spoilers for future episodes in this thread, those belong in the spoiler thread.

[Warduke]

There really isn’t much I can say about this episode that Leoff hasn’t said already, since there’s no Tara, there’s nothing W/T to report, so I’ll just add a few bits here and there…

For Garfield…When Willow says Tara’s name, she just looks sad and she wasn’t with B/D when the candles were mentioned.

Buffy talking to the Doris (social services) about living with Willow “It’s not a gay thing you know, she’s gay but we don’t gay, not that’s there’s anything wrong with.”

When W/X are talking at the house, Willow did say something that could be foreshadowing…”Doesn’t matter if I jumped off the wagon completely.”

Willow/Xander talking in the alley, Willow says something that was so Willowy “Betcha-by-golly-wow.”

After waiting so long for a new episode…this is what we get?, I didn’t like this episode and seeing that we now have to wait three more weeks for the next new episode, life sucks.

[canadian kitty]

Ahh, the discussion thread. How I missed you. You who signifies the return of a new episode.

I thought 'Gone' was a little low key but I liked it. I needed an episode with minimal angst and this filled that requirement nicely.

Sadly no Tara but it's good to see the return of brainy Willow, resisting magik and using her smarts to expose those annoying nerds.

Oh. And I hope there going somewhere with this Buffy/Spike thing because it just canÕt get anymore disturbing.

Well looky there. I'm now officially licensed to float roses.

[This message has been edited by canadian kitty (edited January 07, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by canadian kitty (edited January 07, 2002).]

[Scout]

quote:

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Originally posted by Warduke:
When W/X are talking at the house, Willow did say something that could be foreshadowing…”Doesn’t matter if I jumped off the wagon completely.”

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Brian, can you give a little more detail as to the context of that statement. Did it seem like Willow wasn't taking her rehab seriously?

Thanks!

quote:

[Warduke]

No, she is taking her rehab seriously, Xander thought that Willow was the one who made Buffy invisible, so Willow was hurt that he would think that, so she said "So now when anything nasty happens I get conveniently blamed for it?" and then said "Doesn’t matter if I jumped off the wagon completely." Xander believes that she didn't do it but she leaves to go take a walk.

[LilyOphelia]

You are all so kooky...the girls...they will be back together...they have to! I've wished on many first stars I saw those nights, and the pennies...do you know how many pennies I'd be out...to those copper eating fountains, if they didn't get back together...the universe just doesn't work that way...the slowness will be cute...Willow just has to be her again...the girl Tara loves...you'll see

With Love,
Lily Ophelia Nightingale

[Kiwiccan]

Brian are you indicating that you think this possible foreshadowing is negative and that W/T will not get back together???

Nervous in NZ.

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Paula
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Amber FanGirl #1a; May the Amber Force be with you.
Keeper of my own insanity
"I love being a girl, having a girl.." ~as sung by Amber Benson in the UK

[This message has been edited by Kiwiccan (edited January 07, 2002).]

[Warduke]

NO NO, that is not what I think.

It probably was just Willow saying that no matter what she does to stay away from magic, her friends will still not completely believe her.

I just meant that is was possible foreshadowing of Willow falling off the wagon…does anyone believe that Joss is done with Willow’s addiction?…me neither.
I didn’t mean that W/T won’t get back together or that if they were already back together, that Tara would leave Willow for good if she did fall off the wagon, just that Joss is far from done with this storyline, and since it is an addiction storyline, he’ll never be done with it.

[xita]

I'd have to see this ep, but back when wrecked aired, I knew that Willow was going to try real hard to stay off it and that Buffy meant none of what she had said. It's going to be hard for Willow and I think it's more of a foreshadowing for something else.. damn , maybe when I see it i can tell you what about in the spoiler thread

[shellybean]

where can I find Leoff's summary?

[Dr.G]

As is the case with every episode, the link to the Wildfeed is always posted in the Complete Spoiler Thread of said episode.

[This message has been edited by Dr.G (edited January 08, 2002).]

[xita]

Ok, I get to post my thoughts based strictly on wildfeed and canadian reports.

So Buffy is about to be shot by Warren. Willow realizes that the invisibility gun is set to kill. So her Willow's best friend in the whole world is about to be killed and Willow shouts for her to duck? She doesn't do any magic to save her? Wasn't this the sort of test people wanted Willow to be put through?

[Dr.G]

Good point, and it sounds like she passed.
Personally, I hope they will work towards Willow using magic when there is a *need* for her to. Like to save Buffy's life, or to battle the bad, not to pick up a book. I mean, I hope it won't come down to it that Willow can never use any type of magic again, but that she will learn and be able to use it wisely and sparingly, like Tara. That will be quite an accomplishment indeed if she is able to pull it off, after having abused it.

[Wiccagrrl]

I really hope that's the case. Not sure if they'll go the direction of having Willow the magic addict learn to use responsibly, but I'll be very sad if she ends up giving it up completely. Of course, at least at first, she'll have to. But maybe down the line, who knows? It's gonna be interesting.

[Lax Scrutiny]

Hello, all, I'm delurking just now, been visiting here for a year or so....

I did a rough estimate in my head the other day after reading some comments on "anti-magic" on another board. Anyway....

Times when Scoobies Needed Magic:

Season 1: none
Season 2: maybe one. Arguable that restoring Angel's soul was a "good thing", but Buffy had that problem "solved" with a sword-point regardless.
Season3: Willow stakes a vamp with a pencil when captured by the Mayor. Arguable here, this didn't help her escape, or solve any problems, and the Mayor wanted her alive for the time being.
Season4: Willow fogs up the Initiative's sensors when they are looking for Spike, but it's the toilet that saves the day. OK, the big one, Willow and Tara move the Coke machine. Tara dazzles Veruca. The gang Combines to defeat Adam. (Last one I'd argue, although it looks cool. Reilly blows up Forrest conventionally, there's no actually "proof" that Adam could only be defeated by Magic).
Season5: Willow and Tara teleport Glory, Willow casts a Barrier. Willow fixes Tara's brain. I can't think of anything else that season that was helpfull or necessary. Buffy always "had" the means to defeat Glory sitting in the Magic Box, she just never thought to use it.

So my point, "Is magic REALLY necessary?" Has it really ever been necessary to the show, and does having a magic solution up your sleeve allow the writers to write "better" stories?

A closing comment about Xita's point, since Buffy didn't get shot, it obviously wasn't "necessary" to use magic to save her. "Oh, I'll just take a little Heroin right now just in case things get to bad to handle." There are plenty of ways to deal with situations, is it "wrong" that Willow didn't pull out a gun and shoot someone in that scene?

OK, back to my lurkee corner.....

[meo_willowtarafan]

Oh, in Season 1, there was that time in "The Witch" where it was necessary to switch Amy and her Mom ... so that Amy could end up a witch ... and ratted.

[meo_willowtarafan]

Yippee! I'm a "D. E. Crystal"!!

[xita]

I wasn't talking about reviving, I was talking about magic as a defensive measure to stop the murder of her best friend from happening.

[Dr.G]

quote:

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Originally posted by Lax Scrutiny:

Tara dazzles Veruca.

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I assume this was a Freudian slip or otherwise I missed something.

As for the magic, I can think of a few more times it would have come very much in handy, but W/T moving the soda machine and Willow saving them all and especially Tara with it at the end of S5 is all the reason I need to feel it is a very useful tool to the scoobies. I do not understand the comparison with gunwaving really. Willow never killed an innocent bystander with her magic, like say Xander has done. She is capable enough to use it without 'shooting' someone.

Willow not using it when she thought her friend's life was in danger makes me feel like she is truly trying to get herself under control, and she managed it, she could have justified doing what she basically is longing to do by saying she did it to save Buffy. She did not, good for her.

Having said all that, if Willow or Tara for that matter never use magic again, I will not love them any less or find them any less interesting.

[This message has been edited by Dr.G (edited January 08, 2002).]quote:

[Ham]

Well although it's true that this ep will not be present in my list of the greatest Buffy eps of all time, it was alright.
Willow seemed to be making a great effort to stay on the wagon and not make "pit stops". I liked the way she got all flumoxed when she thought Xander saw her about to float the book.
The scene at the espresso pump was good, though I wouldn't blame her using magic waiting for web pages to load
I think the problems with the ep lay in my lack of interest in B/S, I just don't care much anymore, the whole thing has become a little repetative at the moment. Also the lame gunmen were, well, lame. Either get evil or get out of here I say. This whole bumbling idiot thing just isn't working for me. Also I didn't really get Dawn's rage at the Buffster being blinvisable. She just got really pissed off in a very short space of time. I mean I know she's not that chummy with her sis right now, but not even one patented Dawnster quip? I felt a little robbed.
But as always it was Buffy so it had some classy moments. Buffy whistling the opening number from OM,WF as she left the social services. The whole cup thing, who wouldn't wanna do that? Plus the haircut thing, it's nice to be back to some good ol' fashioned running gags. Felt like coming home. Maybe it's just me, but the eye thing with the balls, that was funny.
Not the best ep, but it was good to have an angst break. Now bring back the angst, oh and some Tara.

Also, I don't know about anyone else but I think Anya mentioning D'Hoffryn is major foreshadowing.

[This message has been edited by Ham (edited January 08, 2002).]

[WiccanBex]

i really loved that ep (i also really loved how i got it so quickly )

i like buffy's new hair... and i see that willow has gone back to more cuddly clothing... *g*

i feel sorry for spike... poor undead guy.

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"if you throw a stone, something's gonna shatter somewhere. We're all so fragile, we're all so scared."
Convention review site

[Eyes Without A Face]

Well I, for one, do not share what I perceive as an antimagic sentiment expressed by some the last couple of months. I love the fact that Willow can use both brain power and supernatural forces in battle against evil. I absolutely loved the merging spell used to vainquish Adam, even if there could have been other ways (there always are, but not necessarily as much fun to watch). I wondered last year why they never tried that against Glory. The eyes on the Buffy multientity were so endearing, I just wanted to cuddle to her. (Power is so sexy.)

I am so afraid that the Writers That Be will make Willow end up unable to use magic or severely limit her magical power so that she returns to a slightly more mature pencil-levitating computer geek.

I want my Willow powerful! And fries with that!

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Wallpapers
To the popemobile!!!

[lerkin]

In regards to Buffy "getting back to it's roots" or whatever, we also have the "Willow as hostage" senario in this ep. *Sigh* Just like old times

[xita]

There is no pleasing people, some wanted the geek, others wanted the magic, I just want Willow to be happy. Besides Joss has said she's going to reach more of a balance and I believe him.

[Eyes Without A Face]

xita,

That's what I meant when I said "Willow can use both brain power and supernatural forces...".

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Wallpapers
To the popemobile!!!

[WiccanBex]

i don't want willow to completely stop using magick... i think it would send out a much better image if she learned to use magick more responsibly.

but i love the fuzzy computer geek too!

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"if you throw a stone, something's gonna shatter somewhere. We're all so fragile, we're all so scared."
Convention review site

[Eyes Without A Face]

There's no arguing with fuzzy logic.

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Wallpapers
To the popemobile!!!

[tyche]

Can I just ask if it was clear why Buffy cut off her hair? There were conflicting accounts in the early reviews as to whether it was because of Spike or the social services lady.

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Good God, that's a lot of shake!

[grifter]

@tyche
Buffy doesn´t like Spike liking her hair - ergo she cuts it off...it seemed like everything (including the social sec lady) just came crashing down on her and she took her anger out on the hair...

I loved the episode! Soooo hilarious...the nerd-troika just keeps on getting funnier!

And Willow seems to be really trying to quit abusing magic, if she continues this way everything will work out fine.

James Marsters was doing a great job again, talking to Invisible-Buffy...
"If I can´t have you complete...[looking down, obviously at "lil´ spike"]...hey, that´s cheating!"
LOL

Oh, and by the way, loooooooove the new hair. SMG just looks so fine with it (ok, I´m a real sucker for short hair).

[Scout]

A mildly entertaining episode. The invisibility bit was cute for a while. However, I didn’t buy Willow just walking in alone to the lame gunmen's hideout. And how did they know she was coming anyway?

Sorry to see them do so little with Anya again. I feel like she’s spent most of this season sitting at the table in the Magic Box. That girl needs to get out more.

Kudos to Aly for doing such a good job while being in a scene with four people who weren’t even there. And I noticed Willow kept the ray gun at the end – wonder if it will come in handy later like the Buffybot did.

Buffy’s “I don’t wanna die” seemed like foreshadowing. Maybe she can’t even if she wanted to. The next few eps should be interesting.

On a superficial note – Willow looked really hot tonight and I liked Buffy’s hair. Very cute!