by kitten scout » Wed Feb 13, 2002 5:09 am
by Scout » Wed Feb 13, 2002 5:47 am
Very nice.
by MoMack » Wed Feb 13, 2002 6:49 am
by mucifer » Wed Feb 13, 2002 7:22 am
loved that tara is buffy's friend. not only willows gf.sooo important she really is growing into buffy's wise guide from "restless" thus much more central to the show
plus really contrasting how other american shows deal with lesbian characters.
im really annoyed with the xander character he is almost never supportive of anya. always making fun of her in front of their friends. not even there for her in "the body" during the big loss. and the one time he stands up for her is to knock down willow i really hope they address this because it is wayyy interesting.
i was also very suprised spike stood up for willow. didnt seem consistant with his character to not push someone to the dark side. coulda just done it to impress buffy i spose. it seems to me spike has more reason to be a vengeance demon than ceceli in fact i think that's kinda what his past is all about til he got chipped. so why is cecily into vengeance curious where they will go with that. actually she wasnt a bad counscelor for dawn seems that she might have gotten results.
[This message has been edited by mucifer (edited February 13, 2002).]
by Artemisia » Wed Feb 13, 2002 8:01 am
by Dr.G » Wed Feb 13, 2002 9:48 am
quote:
Originally posted by xita:
The other thing I noticed was how w/t didn't touch at all. I mean they were on screen together so often tonight and they didn't touch, not once. And it is so weird. Other episodes it wasn't so obvious cause they don't spend a lot of time together but tonight they did. It really is not normal.
No it is not, but I think they feel it too, and I'll bet that if they *had* touched in those intense moments they would *not* have been able to stop. I'll join Darin in waiting for prime time gay make-up sex in our lifetime.
quote:by Ari » Wed Feb 13, 2002 10:47 am
Also, I think at this point in W/T's relationship/interaction, it's important to remember the severity of what Willow did. Or more importantly how Tara felt about what Willow did. To me, I think that they just really started reestablishing a friendship by the end of OAFA. They're a long way from having anything beyond that, even though it's clear that they're still completely in love with each other.
But that can be a good thing in the long run. Given the way their relationship ended, Willow needs to really learn to respect Tara and certainly Tara now needs to learn how to trust Willow again. In some ways, they really are going to have to rebuild their relationship from the ground up.
I think maybe the best overall side effect of being cursed in that house is that it forced Tara to do something she wouldn't have done otherwise. Spend enough time with Willow to start rebuilding some sort of relationship with her.
Ari
by spuckie » Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:20 am
I gotta say tho, they are building up for something wonky to go on between anya and Xander. Reminds me of his restless dream where dream anya sez she's thinking of getting back into vengence. She was definitely psycho anya today. Also, since anya found dawn's collection of stolen goodies, does this mean anya now has d'hoffryn's medalion that dawn took from willow? seems it was in with all the jewelry etc.
Does anyone think willow and tara may partly fill the void of giles leaving? With willow as the investigator/knowledge gal, and tara as the emotional support (for buffy etc).
A last lamo thought on why spike can smack buffy around. Is it possible that spike really does love buffy (gag), and since he does, any hitting he does is not with the intent to kill? I seem to recall some line or other last season or before, where he sez if he doesn't intend to do real harm the chip doesn't give him pain blablabla..
I also found a trend in the last two episodes that attempts to almost normalize buffy/spike. Buffy doesn't seem as wigged out about it, and spike is acting like a real (tho secret) boyfriend. Is it all getting less offensive, or am i getting immune to the ick factor? hmmm.
by GODisTigger » Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:28 am
quote:
Originally posted by Wiccagrrl:
Well, it's an interesting theory. To tell you the truth, I'm not even sure if Hallie's pendant would work for Anya, or if it is specific to the justice demon in question.
I thought she was just going for it to smash it since that was the other way to end the spell. Also, didn't she say that the demon who cast the spell was the only one who could break it? So it wouldn't have done her any good to try to use the pendant if that was the case.
quote:
Originally posted by spuckie:
Also, since anya found dawn's collection of stolen goodies, does this mean anya now has d'hoffryn's medalion that dawn took from willow? seems it was in with all the jewelry etc
That medallion was something that was on sale at the Magic Box.
D
[This message has been edited by GODisTigger (edited February 13, 2002).]
quote:quote:by Web Warlock » Wed Feb 13, 2002 11:52 am
If he sided with Willow against Anya, then everyone would point to how this "shows" he does not really love Anya.
If he sided with Anya against Willow (as he did), well we know that.
If he made no choice at all then everyone would be complaining that he did not have a backbone.
Personally I thought Anya's and Xander's reactions were dead on. Given, I am very glad Tara stood up for Willow, especially since it was obvious at the end that Willow could have done nothing anyway.
Xander made the only choice that he could. After all from his point of view, his fiancé was panicked, he had just been hacked on by a demon that wanted to kill all of them, and after fighting in untold number battles with evil things (without the benfit of magical powers or super strength himself) how hard could overcoming a magical addiction be? Remember from his point of view.
Xander has his issues (dating back to the beginning really), but I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. He stood by the woman he loves. The same thing that Tara did.
Warlock
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Web Warlock
web.warlock@attbi.com webwarlock@planetadnd.com
Author, the Netbooks of Witches and Warlocks
The Other Side: http://www.xtreme-gaming.com/theotherside/
Shadow Earth Games: http://www.rpghost.com/WebWarlock/
--
"I wish you would stop licking me and untie me!"
by AutumnT » Wed Feb 13, 2002 12:16 pm
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Autumn
I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.
by xita » Wed Feb 13, 2002 12:17 pm
And I would buy your argument if there wasn't more evidence. Earlier in the episode he is glad Willow has been keeping a stash. Buffy and Tara hang their heads and only then is he able to look beyond himself and think of Willow.
And then I started thinking of how much he has talked behind her back but never told her how he felt and this was before wrecked. Then in gone he was quick to believe the worst of her and assumed she'd been doing magick. I am not saying xander is worse than the others, it's just clearly this is his problem. And it gets to me because so many online think he is as mature as Tara.. yeah right.
by WiccanBex » Wed Feb 13, 2002 12:23 pm
i loved the buffy/tara interaction - i like when tara interacts with anyone who isn't willow.
not that i don't like her interacting with willow, because i do. a lot.
but it's nice that she is of some importance to people who *aren't* willow, too... you know?
i mean, it was *really* important to buffy that tara was there. her "you made it!" and the look on her face... like it was *really* important to her that tara came to her party. it was so sweet!
and tara called her "sweetie" (and the buffy/tara shippers reach for their pens...) it was so sweet!
anyways... moving on from that.
i loved that tara stood up for willow... the look of hurt..? disappointment..? on her face when willow said that she'd kept some stuff... that wasn't nice... but the fact that she got all strong-willed and powerfull and stuff when anya was being mean... that i liked.
spike never ceases to make me laugh - every single ep... and the way that tara was teasing him... that was very cool.
actually... the fact that there was a lotta tara... that was very very cool - contributing to a very large part of the general coolness of the episode.
i'm tired... i'm talking crazy again... so i'm gonna go.
good ep.
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"if you throw a stone, something's gonna shatter somewhere. We're all so fragile, we're all so scared."
Convention review site
by Web Warlock » Wed Feb 13, 2002 12:33 pm
I think we have all seen evidence, especially in this episode, that Tara is the most mature member of the group.
Anya and Xander both have a bit of growing up to do, something else I think was evident here. But Anya does still have that "older than the rest" quality about her.
At least we did get see a little more maturity coming from Buffy this time.
Warlock
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Web Warlock
web.warlock@attbi.com webwarlock@planetadnd.com
Author, the Netbooks of Witches and Warlocks
The Other Side: http://www.xtreme-gaming.com/theotherside/
Shadow Earth Games: http://www.rpghost.com/WebWarlock/
--
"I wish you would stop licking me and untie me!"
by Scout » Wed Feb 13, 2002 12:45 pm
As for Xander seeming more mature, I think that's because he's had so few storylines this season. You don't see him doing much but sitting around the research table criticizing others - that makes him look mature. But the one time he did get a storyline, he forced everyone to sing and killed a man. Maturity at its finest.
by Shaniezak » Wed Feb 13, 2002 1:07 pm
For my part I'm going to say that really, all of the Scoobies have had their good moments this season. They've also pretty much all shown some serious shortcomings at some point or other. Like Anya, who's been shown at her most petty and materialistic, but has also demonstrated a pretty helpful knowledge of demons in Giles's absence. We've seen Willow's weaknesses and her moments of strength, and we've seen the amazing change in Tara from the beginning of the season up until now. I know we're all very reluctant around here to speak ill of Tara, but let's be honest--she wasn't the most assertive or confident person among the Scoobies at the beginning of the year. There were glimpses, but nothing as consistent as she showed in OAFA.
They've all had their good and bad moments. Which, if you ask me, is as it should be for them at this stage in their lives . . . some people can be more mature in certain ways than others, and vice versa . . . The writers are definitely leading up to something with the way they're portraying all the characters right now. Finding out should be fun . . .
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"And if there is a way to find you, I will find you . . . but threads that are golden don't break easily . . ." -- Tori Amos
"Love is lightning, love is ice; it only strikes the lucky twice--once so you will know the price, and once for crazy faith . . ." -- Alison Krauss and Union Station
by TyRex316 » Wed Feb 13, 2002 1:10 pm
by concrete » Wed Feb 13, 2002 1:14 pm
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It's not so much that I'm always right, it's just that I'm never wrong.....
by Blixxt » Wed Feb 13, 2002 1:57 pm
Hehe, seriously, I hope Clem returns, seeing him watch cartoons and say "Great Party!" had me in stitches.
[This message has been edited by Blixxt (edited February 13, 2002).]
by Dr.G » Wed Feb 13, 2002 2:16 pm
*off to join the circus
[This message has been edited by Dr.G (edited February 13, 2002).]
by Ari » Wed Feb 13, 2002 2:25 pm
It's been clear ever since Gone that he pretty much expects her to fail or at least stumble (which I've noticed a lot of fans do, while I really don't). I think part of Xander's issue is the same thing so many people complain about, he's really had no serious challenges and trauma like the others have this season. That seems to have hurt his ability to really get a grasp on what Buffy and Willow in particular have been going through.
Of course, that probably means that he's due for some hard core trauma by the end of the season.
Ari
by xita » Wed Feb 13, 2002 2:26 pm
by Warduke » Wed Feb 13, 2002 2:30 pm
Like I said before, what he did was unforgivable, I really don’t care if he backed up Anya or not, the one time he does decide to stand with her, and this was it, to force Willow to do magic, to give in to her addiction, well with friends like that, Willow really doesn't need any enemies, now does she. [This message has been edited by Warduke (edited February 13, 2002).]
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We keep calling Willow's problem an addiction, and the show uses a lot of addiction symbolism for the problem Willow has, but it actually goes much deeper. Its roots are deeply embedded in issues like insecurity and responsibility. It's the entire Scooby Gang's problem in some ways, not just Willow's.
And judging from some of the fan reactions I've seen, it's a problem in the audience, too. "Super Willow" was mighty handy to have around, and now some people are saying it's irresponsible of her to withhold her powers when the lives of others are at risk. The gang needs to learn that Willow is more than just a "magic tool" they can whip out whenever they need to. She's a person, fighting for her own life. That needs to be respected - on both sides of the fourth wall.
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Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)
[This message has been edited by BBOvenGuy (edited February 13, 2002).]
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I think that if you look at the big picture, that Xander's reason was that "they" could help Will fight the magic addiction again. But as Xita has pointed out, Xander was not very supportive in the first place. There is really nothing that points to Xander being supportive at all to Willow.
Also looking at the big picture, Anya in the ends admits, that nothing would have helped. Only Hallie could lift the curse.
So really Xander and Anya wanted to put Will in danger of becoming addicted again, for purely selfish reasons. Xander was more concerned with a panicking Anya than his bleeding "friend".
But which ever way you spin it, I agree with the Brian, Xander really crossed the line.
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"Everyone's getting spanked but me."
[This message has been edited by Rally (edited February 13, 2002).]
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Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)
IP: Logged
I really LOVED that we saw sooo much of Tara in this episode, the scene with Willow and at the bottom of the stairs was priceless, I liked how they finished each others sentences, very cute, and Tara standing up for Willow was just amazing, I literally stood up and cheered, and at the end when Tara is packing up all the stuff that Willow had and Willow told her that she wouldn't have used it and Tara said that she understood and that it time that she work without a safetynet and gave Willow that patened Tara-smile completely filled me with hope.
I gotta agree with some of you guys I didn't like the whole Anya and Xander trying to force Willow to do magic, I know they were scared but I think that they could've handled it better.
I'm glad that Dawn's stealing was finally brought to light.
I really loved Tara teasing Spike, that was just too much.
All in all I'd say it was great episode and like I said before it left me with a lot of hope for our girls.
Lonewolf
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Personally, I don't really think that either of them should get too much heat for what happened. The circumstances in the house were extenuating. Anya was having a panic attack (READ: non-logical, non-calm, non-rational response) about being trapped in the house. Clearly, she has some claustrophobia issues. Anya has been through a lot with the scoobies, and has fought along side them and kept her head time and time again. Her reaction was not the norm for her. She was having major personal issues, and was *panicked.* I don't think if she had been thinking clearly that she would want to pressure Willow into using magic, under any circumstance. If I recall correctly, she was the first of the scoobies to really acknowledge that Willow DID have a magic problem - I'm thinking back to the scene at the magic box in Wrecked (I think) when Willow whips out her laptop and does the hocus pocus, and Anya is the only person to confront her and say that she was scaring everyone with the magic use. In fact, she was rather blunt about how Willow needed to STOP using magic. She just wasn't thinking clearly last night. I could see her giving Willow a somewhat roundabout Anya-style apology in the near future for how she was towards her. I truly believe that Anya loves the scoobies in her own convoluted way, and would not purposefully sabotage Willow's recovery, despite their past problems.
As far as Xander is concerned, I think he was overwhelmed by Anya's flip out. We really haven't seen that from her, and in my opinion he was stunned and desparate to find a way to calm her down. Again, I think his response was a 'heat of the moment' response, and if he had been really thinking he would not have consciously put pressure on Willow to relapse.
This is not to say that I think what they did was right, either of them. It wasn't, and I'm really glad Tara was there to step in. What I am saying is that they are human and therefore fallable, so I think we shouldn't be so quick to judge.
On a side note, I was really happy to see Emma have the opportunity to show her stuff. She was wonderful, and it was nice to see her showing emotions that were beyond the scope of her usual MO of comic relief. I was so moved in the scene where she discovers Dawn had stolen from the Magic Box. I expected her to fly off the handle about the money, but she was genuinely shocked and hurt, and Emma really conveyed that in a subtle, effective way. Yay Emma!
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"You're in my blood like Holy Wine
You taste so bitter, and so sweet
Darling, I could drink a case of you
And still be on my feet;
I would still be on my feet."
-Joni Mitchell
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Things I think about while being stuck in a hotel.
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Autumn
I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.
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quote:
Originally posted by spuckie:
Does anyone think willow and tara may partly fill the void of giles leaving? With willow as the investigator/knowledge gal, and tara as the emotional support (for buffy etc).A last lamo thought on why spike can smack buffy around. Is it possible that spike really does love buffy (gag), and since he does, any hitting he does is not with the intent to kill? I seem to recall some line or other last season or before, where he sez if he doesn't intend to do real harm the chip doesn't give him pain blablabla..
Right with ya on both counts.
Anyone notice how Anya thinks about her own feelings and always tears people down to get what she wants, and Tara empathizes with everyone and helps them build positive feelings from within.
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I actually feel really sorry for Dawn and I am glad the other scoobies know how she feels now, especially Buffy.
Xander and Anya? Well I really want to hit them, they had no right to push Willow into using magic and Anya was damn right insulting about Tara and her powers Grrr.
Oh and the Tara/Spike moments were just so funny.
Overall a great episode and I look forward to seeing where it goes from here.
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'The cold and ruthless sea tossed the lovers' into the starry black night. together they fall, together they sleep. forever.. forever.. *whisper*forever..the cold and ruthless sea...' By Sweets
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quote:
Originally posted by BBOvenGuy:
We keep calling Willow's problem an addiction, and the show uses a lot of addiction symbolism for the problem Willow has, but it actually goes much deeper. Its roots are deeply embedded in issues like insecurity and responsibility. It's the entire Scooby Gang's problem in some ways, not just Willow's.And judging from some of the fan reactions I've seen, it's a problem in the audience, too. "Super Willow" was mighty handy to have around, and now some people are saying it's irresponsible of her to withhold her powers when the lives of others are at risk. The gang needs to learn that Willow is more than just a "magic tool" they can whip out whenever they need to. She's a person, fighting for her own life. That needs to be respected - on both sides of the fourth wall.
well said....i think xander was really inconsiderate last night (even though i still love xander)....when will said she had stuff in the house tara and buffy looked upset but xander jumped to say that it was a good thing and didnt change his mind till he saw the look on buffy's and tara's faces....xander has to wake up and help his best bud out...geez buffy had so many problems this season and even she understands it
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Richard was wearing a RED SHIRT!!
Mrs.Wiccie totally didn't get why I laughed my ass off when Richard first appeared, then laughed even harder when he got wounded. I'm a sick, sad geekgirl...
Tara Great. Willow Finey McFine Fine.*drool*
I have nothing else to add to this discussion.
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Big kudos to Drew Greenberg. I said after his first outing (heh) that he needed to find his feet with the characters; after this its pretty clear he found not only his feet but his whole body. There was lots that I loved about this ep from a Tara and W/T perspective, but I also loved this ep as a plain old Buffy the Vampire Slayer fan, something I haven't been able to say much of late. And it's mainly because the focus was on the ensemble--it wasn't (thank God) The Buffy and Spike Show, everybody got juicy bits and it was wonderful. I even cared about Xander and Anya, which surprised me...when I rewatched it I didn't fast-forward through their scenes. Emma in particular was great, as everyone's been saying--SO nice to see her get a chance to be something other than perky and/or rude.
Still it was mostly the Tara and W/T stuff that got me, of course--just the fact that there was W/T stuff at all made me indescribably happy. I guess I can't really say anything that hasn't already been said, just that I loved everything about it. It was totally weird for them not to be touching each other...in that first awkward scene it was like there was all this intense romantic/sexual energy crackling around them and through them and they just didn't know what to do with it, it came out as babbling and fidgeting and it was just SOOOOOOO obvious how much in love they are. And I loved Willow up in her room just before she came down, fixing and re-fixing her top...it was so cute and first-datey. I feel so positive about the W/T future now. Willow having the stash was a bit of a setback, but not as much as I feared from having read spoilers about it. Tara was so understanding and encouraging in the kitchen scene, now that she has seen for herself how serious Willow is about not doing magick.
I swear I just about died from pride and happiness when Tara stepped up on Anya. "Hey! You're gonna back off!" Not "you better back off," but "you're gonna back off." What a woman. Oh, and speaking of--
Rally wrote: "I just saw in another forum, someone take X/A side and said Tara was wrong. That Anya was doing what needed to be done and that Tara wasn't looking at the big picture."
Putting aside my usual pleas not to repeat what is said at other forums, I wanted to comment on this. In fact Tara was looking at the big picture. I was sort of comparing this to "Choices", when Buffy wants to trade the Box of Gavrok for Willow and Wesley is against it because if they destroy the box they halt the Mayor's Ascension. He wasn't seeing the big picture in that case--he saw it as a black and white decision, trade one life for thousands. But Buffy knew that while destroying the box was the most expedient means of stopping the Mayor, it wasn't the only way. She knew there was a chance to save Willow and stop the Mayor some other way, and in fact she did. In the same way, Anya saw a spell from Willow as the most expedient way to get out of the house, ignoring (as Wesley did) concerns for Willow's safety, whereas Tara was able to step back and see that the most expedient solution was not the best or only solution, and that if they kept thinking they'd figure something else out (which she in fact had just said) that didn't endanger Willow. So there.
Need I say how much Amber completely rocked in this ep? Well I will anyway--Amber completely rocked in this ep. I'm not convinced that Tara's teasing of Spike is completely good-natured...I think she's trying not to be judgmental but is understandably concerned about Buffy (so loving the growing B/T friendship BTW) and wants to protect her and so is subtly warning Spike to watch himself. The thing that really keyed it for me was her expression after the "maybe you should put some ice on it" line. It was like, "I'm being humorous here but also serious. Watch yourself."
One thing that was weird about this ep...I didn't really understand the presence of some of the tertiary characters, from a writing perspective. I mean, I got why Richard and certainly Hallie were there, but why Sophie and Clem? Not that it bothered me, in fact I enjoyed both of them and would be happy to see more of them, I'm just not sure why they were there.
Oh and one more thing--AutumnT wrote: "...we did learn this episode...that apparently both Willow and Xander are older than Buffy as they were debating a beer run and would have to be 21 to do so."
We also saw Will drinking a martini in "Smashed"...but the show has been kinda weird about the alcohol thing. Just last week Buffy was presumably drinking beer ("nectar of the working man") at the Bronze even though this week was her 21st birthday. And in "Family" it seemed like everyone was drinking alcohol, or why their reactions when Dawn says it's "for losers"?Yet Anya couldn't get served in "Doppelgängland". I dunno.
Anyway, great ep. Five stakes from me.
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[This message has been edited by Warduke (edited February 13, 2002).]
IP: LoggedBBOvenGuyStrong like an Amazon We keep calling Willow's problem an addiction, and the show uses a lot of addiction symbolism for the problem Willow has, but it actually goes much deeper. Its roots are deeply embedded in issues like insecurity and responsibility. It's the entire Scooby Gang's problem in some ways, not just Willow's.
And judging from some of the fan reactions I've seen, it's a problem in the audience, too. "Super Willow" was mighty handy to have around, and now some people are saying it's irresponsible of her to withhold her powers when the lives of others are at risk. The gang needs to learn that Willow is more than just a "magic tool" they can whip out whenever they need to. She's a person, fighting for her own life. That needs to be respected - on both sides of the fourth wall.
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Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)
[This message has been edited by BBOvenGuy (edited February 13, 2002).]
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posted February 13, 2002 16:40 Like I said on the Complete Spoiler thread, it was inevitable that sooner or later the gang would get into a jam where they'd want Willow to start casting spells again. Willow's witchcraft wasn't just powerful. It was mighty darn convenient, too. Something was bound to happen that would remind everyone just how convenient it was.We keep calling Willow's problem an addiction, and the show uses a lot of addiction symbolism for the problem Willow has, but it actually goes much deeper. Its roots are deeply embedded in issues like insecurity and responsibility. It's the entire Scooby Gang's problem in some ways, not just Willow's.
And judging from some of the fan reactions I've seen, it's a problem in the audience, too. "Super Willow" was mighty handy to have around, and now some people are saying it's irresponsible of her to withhold her powers when the lives of others are at risk. The gang needs to learn that Willow is more than just a "magic tool" they can whip out whenever they need to. She's a person, fighting for her own life. That needs to be respected - on both sides of the fourth wall.
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Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)
[This message has been edited by BBOvenGuy (edited February 13, 2002).]
IP: LoggedRallyCool Monster Fighter I think that if you look at the big picture, that Xander's reason was that "they" could help Will fight the magic addiction again. But as Xita has pointed out, Xander was not very supportive in the first place. There is really nothing that points to Xander being supportive at all to Willow.
Also looking at the big picture, Anya in the ends admits, that nothing would have helped. Only Hallie could lift the curse.
So really Xander and Anya wanted to put Will in danger of becoming addicted again, for purely selfish reasons. Xander was more concerned with a panicking Anya than his bleeding "friend".
But which ever way you spin it, I agree with the Brian, Xander really crossed the line.
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"Everyone's getting spanked but me."
[This message has been edited by Rally (edited February 13, 2002).]
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posted February 13, 2002 16:41 I just saw in another forum, someone take X/A side and said Tara was wrong. That Anya was doing what needed to be done and that Tara wasn't looking at the big picture.I think that if you look at the big picture, that Xander's reason was that "they" could help Will fight the magic addiction again. But as Xita has pointed out, Xander was not very supportive in the first place. There is really nothing that points to Xander being supportive at all to Willow.
Also looking at the big picture, Anya in the ends admits, that nothing would have helped. Only Hallie could lift the curse.
So really Xander and Anya wanted to put Will in danger of becoming addicted again, for purely selfish reasons. Xander was more concerned with a panicking Anya than his bleeding "friend".
But which ever way you spin it, I agree with the Brian, Xander really crossed the line.
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"Everyone's getting spanked but me."
[This message has been edited by Rally (edited February 13, 2002).]
IP: LoggedBBOvenGuyStrong like an Amazon ------------------
Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)
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posted February 13, 2002 16:46 Oh, and one more thing... I hope we see Sophie again, because it's about darn time we had a TV character whose digestive abilities were almost as limited as mine.------------------
Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)
I really LOVED that we saw sooo much of Tara in this episode, the scene with Willow and at the bottom of the stairs was priceless, I liked how they finished each others sentences, very cute, and Tara standing up for Willow was just amazing, I literally stood up and cheered, and at the end when Tara is packing up all the stuff that Willow had and Willow told her that she wouldn't have used it and Tara said that she understood and that it time that she work without a safetynet and gave Willow that patened Tara-smile completely filled me with hope.
I gotta agree with some of you guys I didn't like the whole Anya and Xander trying to force Willow to do magic, I know they were scared but I think that they could've handled it better.
I'm glad that Dawn's stealing was finally brought to light.
I really loved Tara teasing Spike, that was just too much.
All in all I'd say it was great episode and like I said before it left me with a lot of hope for our girls.
Lonewolf
IP: Logged
posted February 13, 2002 16:53 I ABSOLUTELY LOVED tonights episode.I really LOVED that we saw sooo much of Tara in this episode, the scene with Willow and at the bottom of the stairs was priceless, I liked how they finished each others sentences, very cute, and Tara standing up for Willow was just amazing, I literally stood up and cheered, and at the end when Tara is packing up all the stuff that Willow had and Willow told her that she wouldn't have used it and Tara said that she understood and that it time that she work without a safetynet and gave Willow that patened Tara-smile completely filled me with hope.
I gotta agree with some of you guys I didn't like the whole Anya and Xander trying to force Willow to do magic, I know they were scared but I think that they could've handled it better.
I'm glad that Dawn's stealing was finally brought to light.
I really loved Tara teasing Spike, that was just too much.
All in all I'd say it was great episode and like I said before it left me with a lot of hope for our girls.
Lonewolf
IP: LoggedArtemisiaDoll's Eye Crystal IP: Logged
posted February 13, 2002 17:08 Hmm, Surprizing that people are still bashing Willow on the other place I post( a Jane site no less) It has been very Tara love & people not happy with Xander( though by no means bashing him)for his diss of Willow & every one is very proud of Willow. strange. IP: LoggedItaliangirlFloating Rose Personally, I don't really think that either of them should get too much heat for what happened. The circumstances in the house were extenuating. Anya was having a panic attack (READ: non-logical, non-calm, non-rational response) about being trapped in the house. Clearly, she has some claustrophobia issues. Anya has been through a lot with the scoobies, and has fought along side them and kept her head time and time again. Her reaction was not the norm for her. She was having major personal issues, and was *panicked.* I don't think if she had been thinking clearly that she would want to pressure Willow into using magic, under any circumstance. If I recall correctly, she was the first of the scoobies to really acknowledge that Willow DID have a magic problem - I'm thinking back to the scene at the magic box in Wrecked (I think) when Willow whips out her laptop and does the hocus pocus, and Anya is the only person to confront her and say that she was scaring everyone with the magic use. In fact, she was rather blunt about how Willow needed to STOP using magic. She just wasn't thinking clearly last night. I could see her giving Willow a somewhat roundabout Anya-style apology in the near future for how she was towards her. I truly believe that Anya loves the scoobies in her own convoluted way, and would not purposefully sabotage Willow's recovery, despite their past problems.
As far as Xander is concerned, I think he was overwhelmed by Anya's flip out. We really haven't seen that from her, and in my opinion he was stunned and desparate to find a way to calm her down. Again, I think his response was a 'heat of the moment' response, and if he had been really thinking he would not have consciously put pressure on Willow to relapse.
This is not to say that I think what they did was right, either of them. It wasn't, and I'm really glad Tara was there to step in. What I am saying is that they are human and therefore fallable, so I think we shouldn't be so quick to judge.
On a side note, I was really happy to see Emma have the opportunity to show her stuff. She was wonderful, and it was nice to see her showing emotions that were beyond the scope of her usual MO of comic relief. I was so moved in the scene where she discovers Dawn had stolen from the Magic Box. I expected her to fly off the handle about the money, but she was genuinely shocked and hurt, and Emma really conveyed that in a subtle, effective way. Yay Emma!
------------------
"You're in my blood like Holy Wine
You taste so bitter, and so sweet
Darling, I could drink a case of you
And still be on my feet;
I would still be on my feet."
-Joni Mitchell
IP: Logged
posted February 13, 2002 17:21 I have some thoughts about the situation with Xander and Anya pressuring Will to use magick.Personally, I don't really think that either of them should get too much heat for what happened. The circumstances in the house were extenuating. Anya was having a panic attack (READ: non-logical, non-calm, non-rational response) about being trapped in the house. Clearly, she has some claustrophobia issues. Anya has been through a lot with the scoobies, and has fought along side them and kept her head time and time again. Her reaction was not the norm for her. She was having major personal issues, and was *panicked.* I don't think if she had been thinking clearly that she would want to pressure Willow into using magic, under any circumstance. If I recall correctly, she was the first of the scoobies to really acknowledge that Willow DID have a magic problem - I'm thinking back to the scene at the magic box in Wrecked (I think) when Willow whips out her laptop and does the hocus pocus, and Anya is the only person to confront her and say that she was scaring everyone with the magic use. In fact, she was rather blunt about how Willow needed to STOP using magic. She just wasn't thinking clearly last night. I could see her giving Willow a somewhat roundabout Anya-style apology in the near future for how she was towards her. I truly believe that Anya loves the scoobies in her own convoluted way, and would not purposefully sabotage Willow's recovery, despite their past problems.
As far as Xander is concerned, I think he was overwhelmed by Anya's flip out. We really haven't seen that from her, and in my opinion he was stunned and desparate to find a way to calm her down. Again, I think his response was a 'heat of the moment' response, and if he had been really thinking he would not have consciously put pressure on Willow to relapse.
This is not to say that I think what they did was right, either of them. It wasn't, and I'm really glad Tara was there to step in. What I am saying is that they are human and therefore fallable, so I think we shouldn't be so quick to judge.
On a side note, I was really happy to see Emma have the opportunity to show her stuff. She was wonderful, and it was nice to see her showing emotions that were beyond the scope of her usual MO of comic relief. I was so moved in the scene where she discovers Dawn had stolen from the Magic Box. I expected her to fly off the handle about the money, but she was genuinely shocked and hurt, and Emma really conveyed that in a subtle, effective way. Yay Emma!
------------------
"You're in my blood like Holy Wine
You taste so bitter, and so sweet
Darling, I could drink a case of you
And still be on my feet;
I would still be on my feet."
-Joni Mitchell
Things I think about while being stuck in a hotel.
------------------
Autumn
I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.
IP: Logged
posted February 13, 2002 17:32 One of my favorite line readings this episode was how Willow said she was "great" and then backpedaled right away into fine. finey mcfine fine. Just so Tara would not get the impression that Willow was doing great without her in her life. A wonderful little moment.Things I think about while being stuck in a hotel.
------------------
Autumn
I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.
IP: LoggedliveoakBlessed Wannabe quote:
Originally posted by spuckie:
Does anyone think willow and tara may partly fill the void of giles leaving? With willow as the investigator/knowledge gal, and tara as the emotional support (for buffy etc).A last lamo thought on why spike can smack buffy around. Is it possible that spike really does love buffy (gag), and since he does, any hitting he does is not with the intent to kill? I seem to recall some line or other last season or before, where he sez if he doesn't intend to do real harm the chip doesn't give him pain blablabla..
Right with ya on both counts.
Anyone notice how Anya thinks about her own feelings and always tears people down to get what she wants, and Tara empathizes with everyone and helps them build positive feelings from within.
IP: Logged
posted February 13, 2002 17:38quote:
Originally posted by spuckie:
Does anyone think willow and tara may partly fill the void of giles leaving? With willow as the investigator/knowledge gal, and tara as the emotional support (for buffy etc).A last lamo thought on why spike can smack buffy around. Is it possible that spike really does love buffy (gag), and since he does, any hitting he does is not with the intent to kill? I seem to recall some line or other last season or before, where he sez if he doesn't intend to do real harm the chip doesn't give him pain blablabla..
Right with ya on both counts.
Anyone notice how Anya thinks about her own feelings and always tears people down to get what she wants, and Tara empathizes with everyone and helps them build positive feelings from within.
I actually feel really sorry for Dawn and I am glad the other scoobies know how she feels now, especially Buffy.
Xander and Anya? Well I really want to hit them, they had no right to push Willow into using magic and Anya was damn right insulting about Tara and her powers Grrr.
Oh and the Tara/Spike moments were just so funny.
Overall a great episode and I look forward to seeing where it goes from here.
------------------
'The cold and ruthless sea tossed the lovers' into the starry black night. together they fall, together they sleep. forever.. forever.. *whisper*forever..the cold and ruthless sea...' By Sweets
IP: Logged
posted February 13, 2002 18:09 I loved the episode it had the thing the last few episodes have been missing, namely Tara It was so great to see Willow and Tara interacting with each other again and when Tara stood up for Willow *sigh* wow was that a moment to rewatch.I actually feel really sorry for Dawn and I am glad the other scoobies know how she feels now, especially Buffy.
Xander and Anya? Well I really want to hit them, they had no right to push Willow into using magic and Anya was damn right insulting about Tara and her powers Grrr.
Oh and the Tara/Spike moments were just so funny.
Overall a great episode and I look forward to seeing where it goes from here.
------------------
'The cold and ruthless sea tossed the lovers' into the starry black night. together they fall, together they sleep. forever.. forever.. *whisper*forever..the cold and ruthless sea...' By Sweets
quote:
Originally posted by BBOvenGuy:
We keep calling Willow's problem an addiction, and the show uses a lot of addiction symbolism for the problem Willow has, but it actually goes much deeper. Its roots are deeply embedded in issues like insecurity and responsibility. It's the entire Scooby Gang's problem in some ways, not just Willow's.And judging from some of the fan reactions I've seen, it's a problem in the audience, too. "Super Willow" was mighty handy to have around, and now some people are saying it's irresponsible of her to withhold her powers when the lives of others are at risk. The gang needs to learn that Willow is more than just a "magic tool" they can whip out whenever they need to. She's a person, fighting for her own life. That needs to be respected - on both sides of the fourth wall.
well said....i think xander was really inconsiderate last night (even though i still love xander)....when will said she had stuff in the house tara and buffy looked upset but xander jumped to say that it was a good thing and didnt change his mind till he saw the look on buffy's and tara's faces....xander has to wake up and help his best bud out...geez buffy had so many problems this season and even she understands it
IP: Logged
posted February 13, 2002 18:47quote:
Originally posted by BBOvenGuy:
We keep calling Willow's problem an addiction, and the show uses a lot of addiction symbolism for the problem Willow has, but it actually goes much deeper. Its roots are deeply embedded in issues like insecurity and responsibility. It's the entire Scooby Gang's problem in some ways, not just Willow's.And judging from some of the fan reactions I've seen, it's a problem in the audience, too. "Super Willow" was mighty handy to have around, and now some people are saying it's irresponsible of her to withhold her powers when the lives of others are at risk. The gang needs to learn that Willow is more than just a "magic tool" they can whip out whenever they need to. She's a person, fighting for her own life. That needs to be respected - on both sides of the fourth wall.
well said....i think xander was really inconsiderate last night (even though i still love xander)....when will said she had stuff in the house tara and buffy looked upset but xander jumped to say that it was a good thing and didnt change his mind till he saw the look on buffy's and tara's faces....xander has to wake up and help his best bud out...geez buffy had so many problems this season and even she understands it
quote:IP: LoggedwiccieSassy Eggs Richard was wearing a RED SHIRT!!
Mrs.Wiccie totally didn't get why I laughed my ass off when Richard first appeared, then laughed even harder when he got wounded. I'm a sick, sad geekgirl...
Tara Great. Willow Finey McFine Fine.*drool*
I have nothing else to add to this discussion.
IP: Logged
posted February 13, 2002 18:58 OK, after 5 pages of discussion I can't believe that no one has mentioned that:Richard was wearing a RED SHIRT!!
Mrs.Wiccie totally didn't get why I laughed my ass off when Richard first appeared, then laughed even harder when he got wounded. I'm a sick, sad geekgirl...
Tara Great. Willow Finey McFine Fine.*drool*
I have nothing else to add to this discussion.
IP: LoggedDazeyBig Pineapple Big kudos to Drew Greenberg. I said after his first outing (heh) that he needed to find his feet with the characters; after this its pretty clear he found not only his feet but his whole body. There was lots that I loved about this ep from a Tara and W/T perspective, but I also loved this ep as a plain old Buffy the Vampire Slayer fan, something I haven't been able to say much of late. And it's mainly because the focus was on the ensemble--it wasn't (thank God) The Buffy and Spike Show, everybody got juicy bits and it was wonderful. I even cared about Xander and Anya, which surprised me...when I rewatched it I didn't fast-forward through their scenes. Emma in particular was great, as everyone's been saying--SO nice to see her get a chance to be something other than perky and/or rude.
Still it was mostly the Tara and W/T stuff that got me, of course--just the fact that there was W/T stuff at all made me indescribably happy. I guess I can't really say anything that hasn't already been said, just that I loved everything about it. It was totally weird for them not to be touching each other...in that first awkward scene it was like there was all this intense romantic/sexual energy crackling around them and through them and they just didn't know what to do with it, it came out as babbling and fidgeting and it was just SOOOOOOO obvious how much in love they are. And I loved Willow up in her room just before she came down, fixing and re-fixing her top...it was so cute and first-datey. I feel so positive about the W/T future now. Willow having the stash was a bit of a setback, but not as much as I feared from having read spoilers about it. Tara was so understanding and encouraging in the kitchen scene, now that she has seen for herself how serious Willow is about not doing magick.
I swear I just about died from pride and happiness when Tara stepped up on Anya. "Hey! You're gonna back off!" Not "you better back off," but "you're gonna back off." What a woman. Oh, and speaking of--
Rally wrote: "I just saw in another forum, someone take X/A side and said Tara was wrong. That Anya was doing what needed to be done and that Tara wasn't looking at the big picture."
Putting aside my usual pleas not to repeat what is said at other forums, I wanted to comment on this. In fact Tara was looking at the big picture. I was sort of comparing this to "Choices", when Buffy wants to trade the Box of Gavrok for Willow and Wesley is against it because if they destroy the box they halt the Mayor's Ascension. He wasn't seeing the big picture in that case--he saw it as a black and white decision, trade one life for thousands. But Buffy knew that while destroying the box was the most expedient means of stopping the Mayor, it wasn't the only way. She knew there was a chance to save Willow and stop the Mayor some other way, and in fact she did. In the same way, Anya saw a spell from Willow as the most expedient way to get out of the house, ignoring (as Wesley did) concerns for Willow's safety, whereas Tara was able to step back and see that the most expedient solution was not the best or only solution, and that if they kept thinking they'd figure something else out (which she in fact had just said) that didn't endanger Willow. So there.
Need I say how much Amber completely rocked in this ep? Well I will anyway--Amber completely rocked in this ep. I'm not convinced that Tara's teasing of Spike is completely good-natured...I think she's trying not to be judgmental but is understandably concerned about Buffy (so loving the growing B/T friendship BTW) and wants to protect her and so is subtly warning Spike to watch himself. The thing that really keyed it for me was her expression after the "maybe you should put some ice on it" line. It was like, "I'm being humorous here but also serious. Watch yourself."
One thing that was weird about this ep...I didn't really understand the presence of some of the tertiary characters, from a writing perspective. I mean, I got why Richard and certainly Hallie were there, but why Sophie and Clem? Not that it bothered me, in fact I enjoyed both of them and would be happy to see more of them, I'm just not sure why they were there.
Oh and one more thing--AutumnT wrote: "...we did learn this episode...that apparently both Willow and Xander are older than Buffy as they were debating a beer run and would have to be 21 to do so."
We also saw Will drinking a martini in "Smashed"...but the show has been kinda weird about the alcohol thing. Just last week Buffy was presumably drinking beer ("nectar of the working man") at the Bronze even though this week was her 21st birthday. And in "Family" it seemed like everyone was drinking alcohol, or why their reactions when Dawn says it's "for losers"?Yet Anya couldn't get served in "Doppelgängland". I dunno.
Anyway, great ep. Five stakes from me.
IP: Logged
posted February 13, 2002 19:04 See okay, now that was the kind of ep that makes this the best show on TV. Easily the best ep since TR--and just coincidence that it was also the Tara-y-est ep since TR? I think not. I'm telling you, it's like a scientific formula or something, More Tara = Better Episode.Big kudos to Drew Greenberg. I said after his first outing (heh) that he needed to find his feet with the characters; after this its pretty clear he found not only his feet but his whole body. There was lots that I loved about this ep from a Tara and W/T perspective, but I also loved this ep as a plain old Buffy the Vampire Slayer fan, something I haven't been able to say much of late. And it's mainly because the focus was on the ensemble--it wasn't (thank God) The Buffy and Spike Show, everybody got juicy bits and it was wonderful. I even cared about Xander and Anya, which surprised me...when I rewatched it I didn't fast-forward through their scenes. Emma in particular was great, as everyone's been saying--SO nice to see her get a chance to be something other than perky and/or rude.
Still it was mostly the Tara and W/T stuff that got me, of course--just the fact that there was W/T stuff at all made me indescribably happy. I guess I can't really say anything that hasn't already been said, just that I loved everything about it. It was totally weird for them not to be touching each other...in that first awkward scene it was like there was all this intense romantic/sexual energy crackling around them and through them and they just didn't know what to do with it, it came out as babbling and fidgeting and it was just SOOOOOOO obvious how much in love they are. And I loved Willow up in her room just before she came down, fixing and re-fixing her top...it was so cute and first-datey. I feel so positive about the W/T future now. Willow having the stash was a bit of a setback, but not as much as I feared from having read spoilers about it. Tara was so understanding and encouraging in the kitchen scene, now that she has seen for herself how serious Willow is about not doing magick.
I swear I just about died from pride and happiness when Tara stepped up on Anya. "Hey! You're gonna back off!" Not "you better back off," but "you're gonna back off." What a woman. Oh, and speaking of--
Rally wrote: "I just saw in another forum, someone take X/A side and said Tara was wrong. That Anya was doing what needed to be done and that Tara wasn't looking at the big picture."
Putting aside my usual pleas not to repeat what is said at other forums, I wanted to comment on this. In fact Tara was looking at the big picture. I was sort of comparing this to "Choices", when Buffy wants to trade the Box of Gavrok for Willow and Wesley is against it because if they destroy the box they halt the Mayor's Ascension. He wasn't seeing the big picture in that case--he saw it as a black and white decision, trade one life for thousands. But Buffy knew that while destroying the box was the most expedient means of stopping the Mayor, it wasn't the only way. She knew there was a chance to save Willow and stop the Mayor some other way, and in fact she did. In the same way, Anya saw a spell from Willow as the most expedient way to get out of the house, ignoring (as Wesley did) concerns for Willow's safety, whereas Tara was able to step back and see that the most expedient solution was not the best or only solution, and that if they kept thinking they'd figure something else out (which she in fact had just said) that didn't endanger Willow. So there.
Need I say how much Amber completely rocked in this ep? Well I will anyway--Amber completely rocked in this ep. I'm not convinced that Tara's teasing of Spike is completely good-natured...I think she's trying not to be judgmental but is understandably concerned about Buffy (so loving the growing B/T friendship BTW) and wants to protect her and so is subtly warning Spike to watch himself. The thing that really keyed it for me was her expression after the "maybe you should put some ice on it" line. It was like, "I'm being humorous here but also serious. Watch yourself."
One thing that was weird about this ep...I didn't really understand the presence of some of the tertiary characters, from a writing perspective. I mean, I got why Richard and certainly Hallie were there, but why Sophie and Clem? Not that it bothered me, in fact I enjoyed both of them and would be happy to see more of them, I'm just not sure why they were there.
Oh and one more thing--AutumnT wrote: "...we did learn this episode...that apparently both Willow and Xander are older than Buffy as they were debating a beer run and would have to be 21 to do so."
We also saw Will drinking a martini in "Smashed"...but the show has been kinda weird about the alcohol thing. Just last week Buffy was presumably drinking beer ("nectar of the working man") at the Bronze even though this week was her 21st birthday. And in "Family" it seemed like everyone was drinking alcohol, or why their reactions when Dawn says it's "for losers"?Yet Anya couldn't get served in "Doppelgängland". I dunno.
Anyway, great ep. Five stakes from me.
by BBOvenGuy » Wed Feb 13, 2002 2:40 pm
We keep calling Willow's problem an addiction, and the show uses a lot of addiction symbolism for the problem Willow has, but it actually goes much deeper. Its roots are deeply embedded in issues like insecurity and responsibility. It's the entire Scooby Gang's problem in some ways, not just Willow's.
And judging from some of the fan reactions I've seen, it's a problem in the audience, too. "Super Willow" was mighty handy to have around, and now some people are saying it's irresponsible of her to withhold her powers when the lives of others are at risk. The gang needs to learn that Willow is more than just a "magic tool" they can whip out whenever they need to. She's a person, fighting for her own life. That needs to be respected - on both sides of the fourth wall.
------------------
Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)
[This message has been edited by BBOvenGuy (edited February 13, 2002).]
by Rally » Wed Feb 13, 2002 2:41 pm
I think that if you look at the big picture, that Xander's reason was that "they" could help Will fight the magic addiction again. But as Xita has pointed out, Xander was not very supportive in the first place. There is really nothing that points to Xander being supportive at all to Willow.
Also looking at the big picture, Anya in the ends admits, that nothing would have helped. Only Hallie could lift the curse.
So really Xander and Anya wanted to put Will in danger of becoming addicted again, for purely selfish reasons. Xander was more concerned with a panicking Anya than his bleeding "friend".
But which ever way you spin it, I agree with the Brian, Xander really crossed the line.
------------------
"Everyone's getting spanked but me."
[This message has been edited by Rally (edited February 13, 2002).]
by BBOvenGuy » Wed Feb 13, 2002 2:46 pm
------------------
Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)
by Lonewolf » Wed Feb 13, 2002 2:53 pm
I really LOVED that we saw sooo much of Tara in this episode, the scene with Willow and at the bottom of the stairs was priceless, I liked how they finished each others sentences, very cute, and Tara standing up for Willow was just amazing, I literally stood up and cheered, and at the end when Tara is packing up all the stuff that Willow had and Willow told her that she wouldn't have used it and Tara said that she understood and that it time that she work without a safetynet and gave Willow that patened Tara-smile completely filled me with hope.
I gotta agree with some of you guys I didn't like the whole Anya and Xander trying to force Willow to do magic, I know they were scared but I think that they could've handled it better.
I'm glad that Dawn's stealing was finally brought to light.
I really loved Tara teasing Spike, that was just too much.
All in all I'd say it was great episode and like I said before it left me with a lot of hope for our girls.
Lonewolf
by Artemisia » Wed Feb 13, 2002 3:08 pm
by Italiangirl » Wed Feb 13, 2002 3:21 pm
Personally, I don't really think that either of them should get too much heat for what happened. The circumstances in the house were extenuating. Anya was having a panic attack (READ: non-logical, non-calm, non-rational response) about being trapped in the house. Clearly, she has some claustrophobia issues. Anya has been through a lot with the scoobies, and has fought along side them and kept her head time and time again. Her reaction was not the norm for her. She was having major personal issues, and was *panicked.* I don't think if she had been thinking clearly that she would want to pressure Willow into using magic, under any circumstance. If I recall correctly, she was the first of the scoobies to really acknowledge that Willow DID have a magic problem - I'm thinking back to the scene at the magic box in Wrecked (I think) when Willow whips out her laptop and does the hocus pocus, and Anya is the only person to confront her and say that she was scaring everyone with the magic use. In fact, she was rather blunt about how Willow needed to STOP using magic. She just wasn't thinking clearly last night. I could see her giving Willow a somewhat roundabout Anya-style apology in the near future for how she was towards her. I truly believe that Anya loves the scoobies in her own convoluted way, and would not purposefully sabotage Willow's recovery, despite their past problems.
As far as Xander is concerned, I think he was overwhelmed by Anya's flip out. We really haven't seen that from her, and in my opinion he was stunned and desparate to find a way to calm her down. Again, I think his response was a 'heat of the moment' response, and if he had been really thinking he would not have consciously put pressure on Willow to relapse.
This is not to say that I think what they did was right, either of them. It wasn't, and I'm really glad Tara was there to step in. What I am saying is that they are human and therefore fallable, so I think we shouldn't be so quick to judge.
On a side note, I was really happy to see Emma have the opportunity to show her stuff. She was wonderful, and it was nice to see her showing emotions that were beyond the scope of her usual MO of comic relief. I was so moved in the scene where she discovers Dawn had stolen from the Magic Box. I expected her to fly off the handle about the money, but she was genuinely shocked and hurt, and Emma really conveyed that in a subtle, effective way. Yay Emma!
------------------
"You're in my blood like Holy Wine
You taste so bitter, and so sweet
Darling, I could drink a case of you
And still be on my feet;
I would still be on my feet."
-Joni Mitchell
by AutumnT » Wed Feb 13, 2002 3:32 pm
Things I think about while being stuck in a hotel.
------------------
Autumn
I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.
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